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clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Sun Jun 22, 2003 5:57 pm  After much research I've completed a proposed shopping list for my new PC (thanks for your RAID and case inputs, too). Before I buy anything I'm interested in what you folks think about this setup. I've seen many of these "here's my new PC" posts before, but this is the first time I've done one. This will be used primarily for CEP audio restoration/recording work, replacing my 4 year old P3/600. Tired of long waits, I've tried to optimize for very fast file save & copy times. It also has to do home video capture, a new thing for me. The PC is pretty rich, but there are still some cost tradeoffs in here, like it won't be as fast as SCSI. I would like it to last me another 4 years. Sadly it will be on a network sometimes, with lots of corporate software, some of it #%&^!@ but some good stuff too, like full virus and firewall protection. This forces my O/S choice too. I'm thinking of building it myself (first time but not too afraid with a technician background & plenty of friends who do this) using parts from: Newegg; Knowledgemicro; some disks from DigitallyUnique; and a couple other places. So I'd like your opinion on the audio things, like... Will this stuff play well together? What do you think of these Plextor choices (I've never owned a Plextor before). Is LynxOne a good fit for restoration work: clarity, highs, low noise, etc.? What do you think of the suppliers? Have I missed anything major? Motherboard: MSI 875P-Neo-FIS2R with Intel 875P, southbridge and extra Promise SATA. CPU: Pentium 4 2.8GHz with 800Mhz FSB and some Zalman cooler (not picked yet, has to fit). O/S: Windows XP Professional; more or less forced by my employer. Memory: 4x 512MB Crucial PC3200 DDR 400 ECC. Video: Matrox G550. Wanted a P650 but it's not out yet. Sound: existing Sek'd Prodif Plus, or might treat myself to a LynxOne later. OS disk: Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB UATA; on the southbridge primary master (slave is open). Data disks: 3x Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB SATA; 1 on southbridge (CEP temp), 2 on PCI Promise chip (main data; video spare; ATA133 is open). CD writer: Plextor Plexwriter 52x32x52 EIDE (black); on southbridge secondary master, heaviest usage. DVD writer: Plextor PX-504A; on southbridge secondary slave, mainly for DVD recording. SCSI: Adaptec 39160 U160; for tape backup. Power: Antec SL450 450 watts. Case: Lian-Li PC61B (black). [*]Stuff: Some keyboard, mouse, cables, UPS, and 17 inch monitor.[/list:6ce51d5aa0] I'm also planning to get a DAT tape backup device in a couple months, that's what the SCSI's for. My wife is supportive of this high-ticket item, I am just about the luckiest guy alive. I thought about using SCSI for my data discs but it wasn't worth the 4x disk cost. And temporarily I need a video capture card. Thinking of the Pinnacle Deluxe Studio 8 which has PCI video card with audio inputs too. If I can get one from Ebay, I will. Thanks, -clintfan
kylen Posts: 290	Posted - Sun Jun 22, 2003 6:21 pm  Quote: My wife is supportive of this high-ticket item, I am just about the luckiest guy alive. ...Can your wife write a letter to my wife? :D Also, you may have researched this already, I have an older Pinnacle video capture card that uses proprietary MJPEG or some such thing that won't work on another host that doesn't understand it. THat might all be ancient history though... Cool Machine! kylen
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 12:23 am  Quote: Motherboard: MSI 875P-Neo-FIS2R with Intel 875P, southbridge and extra Promise SATA. Be sure to read every review of the mobo before purchasing. I've never used an MSI before, so I'd be a bit on edge trying it out for a DAW. Quote: CPU: Pentium 4 2.8GHz with 800Mhz FSB and some Zalman cooler (not picked yet, has to fit). Save yourself some money and scale it down a little. A 2.4 or 2.5 should be more than you'll ever need, and I'd be really surprised if you can tell a difference with those extra 400 MHz. Quote: Memory: 4x 512MB Crucial PC3200 DDR 400 ECC. Again, 1 GB should be plenty. I'm using 512 of PC2700 and have not yet run into a memory problem. Quote: OS disk: Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB UATA; on the southbridge primary master (slave is open). I use this disk, but 160 GB? This is an OS and program drive, right? You could probably go as small as 5 GB for this one. I'd go for the Diamondmax 8 20 GB drive. _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
SteveG Location: United Kingdom Posts: 6695	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 1:34 am  The trouble with researching all these things is that you are largely dependent on what the manufacturer tells you, especially with new items. I have no idea about your MOBO at all - the only thing that I do know is that in general, the Intel 845/P4 combination seems to work pretty well. But when it comes to what the rest of the board does... who really knows unless they've tried absolutely the same hardware combination as you? The processor speed/FSB issue is getting a bit silly now - it's been clear for a while that what really slows down your throughput is the hardware, like HDDs and CD writers, etc. One thing that is worth considering is that if you are doing a lot of processor-intensive stuff that involves a lot of floating-point math, then a combination of high processor speed and fast L1 and L2 cache memory will speed this up. But how much is determined as much by the OS as anything - this is getting very hard to call. So FX handling is still processor-dependant, yes, but with CEP the result still has to be written to a temp file... and that's the real bottleneck a lot of the time. I'd guess that if you really want to speed things up, one way to do it might be to use a sensibly-sized, blindingly fast SCSI drive just for CEP temp files. But there again, I would have thought that most RAID systems can perform this task at a similar speed now. Has anybody got any thoughts/experience of this? As for wives... SWMBO accepts the upgrade path arguments. To the extent that she currently has the fastest machine in the house, and what does she use it for? Web browsing, email, word processing and report generation. I have an old 266Mhz Athlon-based machine lying around that would do all that just fine, but that's upgrades for you... and anyway, she's threatened to start using the digital camera, so there might be some point in it, I suppose... But since I have constructional responsibility for all the machines in the house except the laptops, this upgrade thing has never been much of an issue. I think that SWMBO's perspective is that if we're going to do this at all, we'll do it properly. And the good news is that ultimately, the definition of 'properly' is basically mine... and I'm playing a long game! And since it's definitely still cheaper to build, like all women, she regards this as better value. But I still get asked about the cost of component parts, as you'd expect! And yes, she has observed all the component price v. specification trends, and quite approves of the idea that now, you can end up with rather more computer for the same money you would have paid three years ago. So as long as we don't do this exercise every five minutes, or if we do, we do it incrementally, we don't really have any arguments about it. _________________
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 2:40 am  As I've alluded to previous (several times) "The Boss" is extremely supportive of my recording endeavors. The biggest drawback is.... making a comment about something like.... "wow!, that's kinda cool" (with no earthy intention of ever spending money on it) and then finding that she's "surprised" me with it later! I've accumulated quite a "pile" of kit that I personally wouldn't have spent a dime on! _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
Havoc Posts: 735	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 3:21 am  A 39160 for a DAT backup is complete utterly overkill! Are you really going to spend for a dual channel 160MB/s scsi controller to control a DAT drive? That controller can support 2 separate chains of 15 devices. And it is 64bit pci compatible (but runs on 32). First check what scsi the dat drive supports and then choose a controller accordingly. Very probably a 2940UW will be plenty. That said, why a dat drive if you are going to get a dvd writer? Otherwise a very nice system, plenty ram.
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 1:57 pm  All great comments! Thank you all for your time. Keep 'em coming if you can. 8) Quote: Can your wife write a letter to my wife?-kylen Well, that would probably be pressing my luck! She does have computer enterprise-level presales and online support experience, so she respects the need for backups. Quote: Be sure to read every review of the mobo before purchasing.-post78 Good point. I should look for more reviews. I had accumulated a large spreadsheet of over a dozen MOBO's, and everything was one tradeoff or another. This one just looked like the most pros, fewest cons. I actually saw one of these MBO's at a local Fry's yesterday, which was encouraging-- it means MSI's not a total unknown. Quote: 1 GB should be plenty. I'm using 512 of PC2700 and have not yet run into a memory problem..-post78 See, that's why I ask you guys!! Thanks, I was wondering about that myself. I was mostly assuming Windows XP would hog more memory than I'm used to. Dropping back to 1GB would free 2 DIMM slots, such that later on when more companies start building 1GB DIMM's (very few do today) I could move up to 3GB without throwing stuff away, if I find I need it. Quote: 160 GB? This is an OS and program drive, right?You could probably go as small as 5 GB for this one. I'd go for the Diamondmax 8 20 GB drive.-post78 Well, not 5GB, since my current setup has already accumulated nearly 6GB of program stuff, some of which admittedly won't move over to the new PC. I've thought about 20 GB as well. But I'm planning to partion this disk 3 ways: OS= 8-12GB, browser cache= 1GB (I really love this detail), and the leftover which, with 160GB, will be huge. So.... why 160? It's those dang video files I'm worried about! >:K It'll mainly be an audio rig, but must take on some new video tasks too. Currently I have no experience with video processing --and this isn't a video forum!-- but I'm doing some reading and the space requirements scare me, so I'm throwing some extra space into the rig. We're talking up to 130GB for 2 hrs. of captured Hi-8. My thinking is that if I need a place to stick some video temporarily, having that large leftover block of space could be a lifesaver. Once captured, it can be compressed down for the save, but until that, it'll be painfully big. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. Plus after this past weekend's local convention, I suspect my wife might want to try making her own Japanese amime fan video, so I'll need space for that too. And yet more software. Quote: The processor speed/FSB issue is getting a bit silly now-SteveG Maybe it is, but I also know that whatever I build today will be a virtual dinosaur in 4 years: my current 3 year old machine has only a 100MHz FSB. We usually buy whatever's fastest at the time, but I'm not going for the 3GHz this time. I'd actually wanted dual CPU, but other folks here have had so much trouble, I'll defer that for next time (depending perhaps on Adobe). I'll look at the 2.6 and check the cost difference. Quote: ...with CEP the result still has to be written to a temp file... and that's the real bottleneck a lot of the time. -SteveG Your point is very true, and is central to my plan. Having had no choice about it before on my current, maxed-out, 1-disk system, I tried to put some real though into CEP temps this time around, to avoid bottlenecks, namely PCI. My data-flow thoughts go like this (and I mention this mostly to get people thinking about their own data paths): Recording from an LP: sound comes off PCI, through southbridge to memory, then back out the southbridge to SATA disk. Saving the recording: data comes off the SATA disk, through southbridge to memory briefly, then back out southbridge to PCI, to SATA disk there. Loading a saved file: reverse of the save. Playback: Like Loading, then after that the reverse of Recording.[/list:a55b86a50e] Quote: I'd guess that if you really want to speed things up, one way to do it might be to use a sensibly-sized, blindingly fast SCSI drive just for CEP temp files.-SteveG Actually, my original plan was for SCSI. Then after studying the bus structures of today's PC's, I scaled this back. I found that unless I go with an older generation Xeon-based $erver MOBO, my options are few: all the desktop MOBO's I found, either have no SCSI available, or hang it off the PCI bus-- the same PCI bus the soundcard sits on. So for bandwidth reasons, my plan, anyway, is to put the CEP temp disk somewhere other than the PCI bus. My options would be firewire, USB, or the IDE or SATA on the southbridge (assuming an Intel platform). Wanting to stay internal, I chose the SATA as it is ever so slightly faster than the IDE, at least with Maxtor's. Quote: But there again, I would have thought that most RAID systems can perform this task at a similar speed... -SteveG I considered RAID, but don't think I'll need it since I don't plan much multitrack. If I find I do need it, that's one reason I'm buying several identical SATA disks now: if I need RAID 0 later, I can move one disk up to pair with the CEP temp disk. :???: Steve, excuse me for asking, but I'm curious: what is SWMBO? (you can email me if you prefer) Quote: A 39160 for a DAT backup is complete utterly overkill! Are you really going to spend for a dual channel 160MB/s scsi controller to control a DAT drive?-Havoc Thanks, I was wondering if anyone would pick up that it's dual. Since you run SCSI, you're familiar. Well, I might spend for it. This was actually sort of a vestige of an earlier plan. My original plan had been a 39320R dual U320 card. Although I don't care about 64 bit at all, I chose that because (a)I was going to build a SCSI rig with fast U320 disks, (b)the tape is only U160, and (c)I've read that if you place a slow-speed device on the same bus with high speed, that whole bus will run at the slower speed. Though I've backed away from SCSI disks due to cost and PCI sharing, I still need external U160 for the tape. So I dropped back to the 39160 U160 card. The only reason I went dual was to give me a SCSI disk option later if I found I really needed a faster data disk, since the cost of a single vs. dual didn't seem to be that different. But you rpoint is well taken: if I went U160 then my disks would be U160 also, so why bother with dual? I have found that all SCSI cards seem to be quite expensive. There wasn't much cost difference between single/dual, U160/U320. But I will also look at single ported cards. One other odd thing about the tape, it's U160 but max's out at only 3MB/s which seems sort of low; maybe I need to ask HP about that (ha-ha). Do you know of any other respectable SCSI adapter brands besides Adaptec? Quote: That said, why a dat drive if you are going to get a dvd writer?-Havoc I'm going for high density, unattended backup, compactness, cost per GB, things like that. DVD doesn't quite fit that for me. But I've also never had a DVD writer before, so I might still find some use for that down the road. Thanks again everyone, -clintfan
SteveG Location: United Kingdom Posts: 6695	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 2:18 pm  She Who Must Be Obeyed. Or you cook your own tea... _________________
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Mon Jun 23, 2003 2:41 pm  Got it.
Havoc Posts: 735	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 3:50 am  Quote: I don't care about 64 bit at all, I chose that because (a)I was going to build a SCSI rig with fast U320 disks, (b)the tape is only U160, and (c)I've read that if you place a slow-speed device on the same bus with high speed, that whole bus will run at the slower speed. 64bit: a dual channel U160 may burst at 320MB. This is above the 32bit pci. Even above 64bit pci at 33MHz. For an U320 controller, pci-x is a must (if you use it for data). a: no problem, and it leaves an option open, but going to u320 disks on a U160 controller would not make much sense when comparing the prices between U160 and U320 ones. b: bit of a mystery, they spec it as U160, but in the list of compatible controllers they list the 2940. Also a 50pin to 68pin cable in the list. It makes me think that it is really UW, but as UW can be used with U160 controllers it will work. Ask HP for more info. c: depends. From U2W and up, you can mix devices and each device will work at its own speed. So the U160 gear will use the 160 speed. But as the 80MB/s U2W holds the bus longer, total maximal throughput will suffer. Then again, this may not matter for a backup that works alone at night. If you plug in a device from before U2W, then the whole bus and all devices will slow down to the lowest common speed (to be avioded at all cost). Quote: One other odd thing about the tape, it's U160 but max's out at only 3MB/s This is the speed writing data from cache to tape. The 160 is writing data from pc the cache. Quote: Do you know of any other respectable SCSI adapter brands besides Adaptec? There is LSI. For U160 LSI is prefered above adaptec. But the U320 from adaptec is praised. Again, if only for backup it would not matter. Quote: I considered RAID, but don't think I'll need it since I don't plan much multitrack. I would think that you would be better of with raid for VIDEO than for audio. Most disks can on their own cope with quite large multitrack setups.
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 11:45 am  Quote: It makes me think that it is really UW, but as UW can be used with U160 controllers it will work. Ask HP for more info.-Havoc Thanks! I studied the manuals again (didn't call HP yet), and I think you're right, the DAT72 is really UW (Ultra Wide), not U160. It quotes "a burst transfer rate of 40MB/s" which would mean UW. However, later it also warns that if you have an Ultra-Wide HBA, "your performance may be impaired; consider [getting an HBA which supports] Ultra2, Ultra3 (160), or Ultra4 (320)". So I guess they're saying if your bus is only UW, they can potentially consume the whole bus, but if you have a faster bus, it won't get that bad. FWIW I also figured out the drive has an HD connector, not VHD. This also supports the UW contention. The specs were quite confusing about that, as they kept talking about an HD-to-VHD cable which comes with it. I guess the expectation is today's HBA you attach to will most likely have VHD. Quote: I would think that you would be better of with raid for VIDEO than for audio. Most disks can on their own cope with quite large multitrack setups.-Havoc I didn't know that about multitrack. I'll definitely keep RAID 0 in mind for the video work if I run into any performance trouble at all. Audio or video, the RAID would only be used for my temp recording files, not permanent storage, so failure of either disk wouldn't be much of a disaster. Quote: Be sure to read every review of the mobo before purchasing.-post78 Thanks again. Last night I sat and read all the MOBO reviews --there were 4 or 5-- so now I have a much better picture of the pros, and more importantly, cons --there some, but I still think I'll try this MOBO. I'll also chop the initial memory back to 1GB. And before I buy I'm going to see if I can tweak things a little more toward being quieter. -clintfan
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 1:32 pm  Quote: And before I buy I'm going to see if I can tweak things a little more toward being quieter. The setup I listed in your other post is about dead quiet. I could honestly just stick it at the opposite end of a good sized room and be completely satisfied. Of course, I won't. That recording was just a simple test. _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
jester700 Posts: 546	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 8:25 pm  Clint, If I read you right, your intending to cap video to the same drive that your OS & swapfile is on? Historically, this has been considered a no-no, but may work OK, since your drive is "big & fast" and you will have a TON o' memory, so swapfile use should be nil. Just pointing it out... Are you using a DV bridge to cap in DV format, or are you going to capture analog with huffyuv, MJPEG, etc? DV format only uses 3.6MB/s, or about 12GB per hour of video. If you were coming from a pro format there might be some color loss, but I doubt that'll happen from Hi-8. Just a thought...
ROBSCIX Posts: 254	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 9:12 pm  Yes, you forgot to mention what your cooling subsystem is going to be comprised of. You also need case fans etc....try I think it's quietpc.com There are all kinds of fans and power supplies out there that are designed to run quiet. What are you going to use for audio monitors? Please don't tel me your going to stick a cheap set of speakers on this system...what a waste... Did you ever consider using multiple monitors. It is really nice for Cool edit and probably a must have for video....
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Tue Jun 24, 2003 11:11 pm  Hey thanks for watching out for me here! By now everybody's probably tired of hearing my PC plans, but I appreciate the continued feedback, keeping me honest. Got the go-ahead for the purchase, so it'll be soon I think. Quote: If I read you right, your intending to cap video to the same drive that your OS & swapfile is on? Historically, this has been considered a no-no... Are you using a DV bridge to cap in DV format, or are you going to capture analog?-jester700 You're right, and I wasn't very clear in my list. My OS and swapfile will be on one physical disk, but my CEP temp /slash/ video capture will indeed go to a different physical disk. Data store will be on 2 additional disks. Right now the SATA drives I'll use for everything except the OS+swap are on backorder practically everywhere, so I probably won't be doing any recording until the supplies improve. Hey thanks for the video feedback! IATYQ the first round of capture will all be analog. Still thinking about whether that can be a firewire "bridge" or a PCI card, right now I'm thinking a card would give me the least risk of dropouts. Once I'm done with the analog, about 20 tapes, I'm done with that, and everything will be DV, over the firewire. We don't have a DV cam yet, but soon; the Hi8 is pushing 12 years now. So yes, later on, being DV, the files will be much smaller. At least this is how I think it'll go, based on what I've read so far. Quote: You forgot to mention what your cooling subsystem is going to be comprised of. You also need case fans etc...-ROBSCIX You're right; "some Zalman cooler" was intentionally vague. I finally settled on this today. I chose an Antec supply with 2 temperature sensitive fans that rates itself quiet, we'll see. A buddy at work got a lower-powered Antec but says it's very quiet. For the CPU I've chosen a Zalman CNPS7000-Cu, rated very quiet and very good at cooling. I checked and they say it fits the MOBO. It also comes with a speed control which reportedly makes it inaudible. I'd worry about burning up the CPU, so I plan to take it easy there. There's already a fan on the northbridge. The Lian-Li case, unfortunately, has 4 fans, all ball-bearing. So we're talking, like, 7 fans: ugghh! That's the cooling plan. Noise-wise, some mods may be required, like maybe moving the HD fans to sit behind the HD's instead of in front, turning some fans off, and/or lining the case with something. There are various resources I can look to for this if necessary. Quote: Please don't tell me your going to stick a cheap set of speakers on this system...what a waste. -ROBSCIX Well the strength of this system is not really supposed to be playback, but efficient movement of very large files. To tell the truth, audio-wise most of the time I will be using headphones, as I do mostly LP & tape restoration, no mixing yet, so monitors are seldom used anyway. Plus, the PC backs up to my kid's bedroom and I'll mainly be using it at night, so speakers are a no-no at those hours. So until we get a bigger house with a music room (dream on) >:K I will probably be stuck with small speakers mainly for the space reason. Small usually implies cheap. And our current home PC runs some cheap powered Kenwoods, but I hand-picked them, LS320's I think, and they don't sound half bad, have a tone control too. But we do need new speakers for the house anyway, so maybe I can swing something more like monitors. I'd like to bring my old nice Yamaha amp out of storage and set it up. But this is getting off into whole other areas though, away from this thread. Quote: Did you ever consider using multiple monitors.-ROBSCIX Well it's still a space thing, we haven't got room right now. If we actually get into doing some Anime I might need it. The video card will handle it. Right now I'm just hoping to find one LCD monitor that I can stare at for hours without screwing up my eyes, can't stand the pink and blue shadows most of them have. -clintfan
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 11:47 am  Quote: For the CPU I've chosen a Zalman CNPS7000-Cu, rated very quiet and very good at cooling. I checked and they say it fits the MOBO. It also comes with a speed control which reportedly makes it inaudible. I'd worry about burning up the CPU, so I plan to take it easy there. There's already a fan on the northbridge. The Lian-Li case, unfortunately, has 4 fans, all ball-bearing. So we're talking, like, 7 fans: ugghh! That's the cooling plan. Noise-wise, some mods may be required, like maybe moving the HD fans to sit behind the HD's instead of in front, turning some fans off, and/or lining the case with something. There are various resources I can look to for this if necessary. Just be warned that the Zalmans are heavy. They warn that if moving the system around, you should probably take the thing off, and that sounds like good advice to me. Of course, those things are harder to seat than those dang Athlon heatsinks... The speed control is part of the fan-mate. As for the fans... You don't need HDD fans. I have the same drive as you, although only 60 GB, and it's sitting only a couple of slots away from another Diamondmax, and I would never think of sticking a fan on it. Oh, and be sure that you get the drives with liquid bearings! A couple of exhaust fans should be plenty, since the PSU fan is also acting as one. The fan-mate helps cool most stuff in there. Really, I'd look into Papst. _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
jester700 Posts: 546	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:19 pm  clintfan wrote: Hey thanks for the video feedback! IATYQ the first round of capture will all be analog. Still thinking about whether that can be a firewire "bridge" or a PCI card, right now I'm thinking a card would give me the least risk of dropouts. Once I'm done with the analog, about 20 tapes, I'm done with that, and everything will be DV, over the firewire. We don't have a DV cam yet, but soon; the Hi8 is pushing 12 years now. So yes, later on, being DV, the files will be much smaller. At least this is how I think it'll go, based on what I've read so far. -clintfan Another possibility is a DV cam with analog passthru, which acts as a DV bridge. This costs more, but saves the couple hundred you might have spent on the bridge. Since you have Hi8, you may want to consider a used Sony digital 8 model. TRV-120 and 320 go all the time on eBay for under $200, have passthru, AND will play back your Hi8s with digital NR and Timebase correction. IOW, they'll look better than they do on the machine that recorded them. Then, if you want a better cam later, use the D8 as an auxiliary for multicam shots. I'd look closely at DV solutions, since they're easy to install & work with.
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:55 pm  Guys, thanks for all your help. Quote: As for the fans... You don't need HDD fans. I have the same drive as you, although only 60 GB, and it's sitting only a couple of slots away from another Diamondmax, and I would never think of sticking a fan on it. Oh, and be sure that you get the drives with liquid bearings! A couple of exhaust fans should be plenty-post78 Thanks for the advice. I'll have 4 drives back to back so maybe they'll run hotter, I'll have to check. If that's not the time to have HD fans, I don't know when is... perhaps 5. I really would like to avoid using some of the fans. And yes, according to Maxtor datasheets, "All DiamondMax Plus 9 drives are equipped with FDB motors" (FDB=Fluid), although early on there was some debate about whether or not they all had it, or if some of the first stock maybe didn't. Quote: Another possibility is a DV cam with analog passthru, which acts as a DV bridge. This costs more, but saves the couple hundred you might have spent on the bridge. Since you have Hi8, you may want to consider a used Sony digital 8 model-jester700 I'd heard about the passthru, but assumed the quality would be lower. Not that Hi8 is great anyway --it's better than straight 8-- I just don't want to lose any definition I might have otherwise been able to get if I'd chosen different equipment, know what I mean? I'd heard some Digital8 could play Hi8, but discounted it because I didn't want to buy a Digital8 as our only new cam. But I hadn't considered Ebay for a temp. used one. The cost would probably be the same, though the files might come in smaller. I'll look into it. Quote: Really, I'd look into Papst.-post78 You really think a BEER would help? Yeah it might, right about now. I just realized that because we're travelling again in about a week, I can't really buy anything until I get back unless I want boxes sitting on the doorstep for weeks, chewing up RMA time. Not a good idea. So I've got more time to stew about this stuff, and buy later, I guess. But hey, the trip'll be great! Yeah yeah, it'll be great! All that driving... Family time and all. Much better than fighting with a bringup PC, right?. Yeah yeah that's right. (Sniff sniff) Seriously, I looked this up and it looks like Pabst makes about 4 or nearly identical 5 variations of quiet power supply fans, all 80mm. Is that what you meant, post? I couldn't find a website specifically for Pabst (not the beer), German or otherwise (not the beer) so I couldn't tell if you were talking about Pabst CPU coolers. :P -clintfan
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 3:51 pm  Quote: And yes, according to Maxtor datasheets, "All DiamondMax Plus 9 drives are equipped with FDB motors" (FDB=Fluid), although early on there was some debate about whether or not they all had it, or if some of the first stock maybe didn't. It's good to know that they do now, because I certainly had to specify not that long ago. I meant "Papst", actually: "Pabst" is the beer. Read my first reply 'How to choose PC case and cooling?', where the link to the fans I purchased sits. _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
ROBSCIX Posts: 254	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 4:11 pm  I use the Maxtor, The fluid Dynamic Bearing is nice makes the drive real quiet, Of course you can always change the drive to give faster performance by setting Acoustic Management. I used a utility that can cahange this register on in the drive controller using a slider. Even if you crank the drive to fast mode, no acoustic managment, You usually can't hear it over your fans anyway...
tomcat Location: USA Posts: 345	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 4:24 pm  "Is LynxOne a good fit for restoration work: clarity, highs, low noise, etc.?" Yes. I use one for radio production, but Greame uses one for the very reason you mentioned (and Greame knows his s#!t). _________________ Tom Robinson Production Supervisor WLAV/WKLQ/WODJ/WBBL Grand Rapids, Michigan
clintfan Location: USA Posts: 455	Posted - Wed Jun 25, 2003 5:04 pm  Quote: I meant "Papst", actually: "Pabst" is the beer. Read my first reply. -post78 Man did I read that wrong! Thanks for clearing that up. Your prior reply gave lots of good links, I guess I homed in on the enclosure and heatsink, then forgot to look at the rest. Tomcat, thanks for the Lynx comment. As I suspected. So FWIW here's the semifinal updated list: Motherboard: MSI 875P-Neo-FIS2R with Intel 875P+fan, ICH5R southbridge and extra Promise SATA. CPU: Pentium-4, 2.8GHz with 800Mhz FSB. Zalman CNPS7000-CU CPU cooler (heavy). O/S: Windows XP Professional; more or less forced by my employer. Memory: 2x 512MB Crucial PC3200 DDR 400 ECC. Video: Matrox G550 dual DVI. Sound: existing Sek'd/Marian Prodif Plus, maybe repl. with a LynxOne later. OS/swap disk: Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB UATA FDB (=fluid bearings), on the southbridge ATA primary master (slave is open). CEP temp disk: 1x Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB SATA FDB, on the southbridge SATA-1 (SATA-2 is open for poss. future RAID-0). Data disks: 2x Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 160GB SATA FDB, on SATA-3 & 4 via the PCI Promise chip, non-RAID setup. CD writer: Plextor Plexwriter 52x32x52 EIDE (black), on the southbridge ATA secondary master, heaviest usage. DVD writer: Plextor PX-504A-BL (black); on the southbridge ATA secondary slave, mainly for DVD recording. Floppy: 1.44 basic Samsung (black). SCSI: LSI U160 dual, for tape backups and possible future disk option. Power: Antec SL450 450 watts. Case: Lian-Li PC-61B with 4 ball bearing fans(black). HP DAT72 36/72GB tape backup (in a few months). Video capture: Pinnacle Deluxe Studio 8, or a used Digital8 cam, to transfer some Hi8. APC Back-UPS 650 Ups. Stuff: Some keyboard & mouse, cables, etc. some video monitor.[/list:bbf89ccd30] Thanks everyone, I think I got all my major questions answered. And some refinements to the plan, thanks to all of you. Just a few details left now. Think I'll open new thread(s) for that. -clintfan
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