Syntrillium Backup Forums :: View topic - [the usual] MAudio Delta 2496 problems...

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Has anyone found a definitive answer to why the 2496 only plays back at 16-bit under WinXP? Is it MAudio's driver?
I've searched all of these forums and read the other posts.
The .27 driver [according to MAudio] is supposed to have 24-bit support for WDM, MME, ...

I tried the .29 driver and I totally lost all sound on the card, it didn't work at all, so I rolled back to .27 and all is working again except still only playback at 16-bits.
Is anyone else having luck (or problems) with the .29 driver?

This would really be nice to get fixed!

Thanks,
David

George W. · Posts: 33

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi George,

When you play back a 24/32-bit file in CE, does it not state "Playing as 16-bit" on the bottom right of the CE StatusBar area?
As far as I know, all 2496's under CE with WinXP do this (has to do with the 2496's driver issues(?)).

I have no problems recording 24/32, I would just like to play back 24-bit...

I assume you never tried the .29 driver?
I wonder what MAudio's "problems" with the driver are... I get no sound whatsoever through the card with this driver.
I was hoping it cured the "play as" bug.

The playback of 24-bit Wav on other players depends a lot on what RIFF formats they support. CE can write a few various 24/32-bit formats, of which many may not be supported on various players.

David

George W. · Posts: 33

Hi David,

When I play a file I've recorded at 24/32 it says 44100 - 32 Bit in the Sample Format box on the Status Bar in Edit View, which is how I recorded it....44100/32. No, I downloaded the 29 driver but after talking to a tech at M-Audio I never installed it. His exact words were: " At this time, the 5.10.00.27 seems to be getting a bit better
performance than the 5.10.00.29." Doesn't really instill much confidence in the newer driver.

I'm not sure why a 32 bit file is playing back in CEP as 16 bit. This is probably a dumb question but when you right-click on the file in Edit View and check the properties does it say it's a 32 bit file? Is it possible it was mixed down to 16 bit? That seems to be a pretty common setting for mixdown.

G.

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi George,

They are 24/32-bit files. The area on the statusbar that lists the format is correctly showing that. I meant to say the "left" of the statusbar during play states "playing as 16-bit".
This is a common problem, as I have found this same thing mentioned on any other messages on this forum.

David

George W. · Posts: 33

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi George,

Limit playback is not checked.

I've double-checked all of the settings in CoolEdit and the Delta2496 and playback should be at 24-bit but it's not.
The other forum messages on this problem also had the same problems even though all settings were correct.

I'm using CoolEdit2000, perhaps this is a bug in CE2000 that is not in CEPro?
There are no "Wave Out" or "Send 32" tabs in CE2000's Settings dialog... "Limit Playback to" is on the "Devices" tab in CE2000.

None of the other forum messages relating to this problem posted any solution other than going back to Windows 98SE, has no one been able to fix it?

If it is a CE2000 bug, I guess I'll just have to wait for my Adobe Audition to show up...

David

George W. · Posts: 33

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi George,

Thanks for the help anyway.
All of the other forum threads I read on this seemed to not be for a specific CE version (2k vs Pro).
I would have assumed that the engine would be the same (makes sense to have only one code-base), and just the Pro's multi-track etc. would be the extra features on that version. Both 2k and Pro are 32-bit/192k according to Syntrillium's info.
The threads that I read, it was mentioned that CE supports MME and not WDM, and that the 2496 was supposed to have 24-bit MME, but it went no farther than that at solving the actual problem. I guess the person(s) with the problems must have simply gone back to Win98SE.
I really doubt that changing to Pro will solve the problem... there is no mention of CE2k being limited on playback.
Probably since Adobe took over, Syntrillium no longer cares about the problem...

David

George W. · Posts: 33

I've been thinking about it, David, and it does seem odd. As I said I playback 24 bit fine unless I choose the 16 bit playback option in CEP 2.1. I would think 2000 would work the same. If not I would have thought someone would have come up with an explanation. You might try posting the question to one of the other CE forums and see if someone else can help. Good luck.

http://home.comcast.net/~kanewell

http://www.adobeforums.com

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi again George,

I downloaded and installed the CEPro demo from the main web site, and it indeed works fine.
CEPro's "extra" support for various 32-bit formats and WDM apparently must be the fix for the 2496 problems.
However, this is a bit disheartening for CE2000 owners as apparently the support/fix? for this was never added to CE2000, yet the main web site feature listing and the online help say that 32/192 is supported, when apparently it is not (with all configurations).
IMHO a slight oversight on Syntrillium's part...
As a long time CE user, and a definite supporter (CE is a top-notch application), my plans were to purchase Adobe Audition anyway, I guess this just gives me another reason to do so.

Thanks,
David

AndyH · Posts: 1425

I suspect that the last updates to CE2k were prior to WinXP. They were certainly prior to CEP 2.0. When CEP 2 was announced, it was made clear that no advances of CEP were to be applied to CE2k anytime in the foreseeable future. Now that CE2k is orphaned, it seems extremely unlikely that it will ever get along perfectly with XP.

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi AndyH,

Yes, CE2000 1.1 Build 2418 is dated 07/2000. Also before the MAudio 2496's .27 driver (05/2002).
I wonder if Adobe (or Syntrillium) will be releasing a mini-Audition version to still capture the under $100 market...

David

RossW · Location: USA Posts: 214

I'm just setting up my new home PC: A Dell Dimension 8300 running XP Home Edition. (Some would say that's two strikes against using a 2496 board.) I'm using CoolEdit 2000, and I'm pretty sure my initial checkout with recording and playing 32-bit files was successful. Previous systems gave me the "Playing as 16 bit" message, so I was looking for it with the new one, and didn't see it. I'll confirm that when I get back home this evening. However, I don't think there's anything inherent with XP/CE2K and the 2496 that prevents playback at greater than 16-bit.

When you look at the Devices tab in CE2K's Settings, does it specify that 24- and 32-bit recordings are not supported?

I'm using the v.27 driver that came with the card; I downloaded the 29 version but decided to keep the earlier release after reading elsewhere in this forum the same comments about 29 being problematic.

Pro_Support · Posts: 85

Here's the deal (in a nutshell): Both CEP and CE2K will support 32-bit recording/playback. However, CEP 1.x and CE2K do not support WDM drivers while CEP 2.x does. That's the issue.

In Windows 95/98/ME, the majority of the drivers are written in MME. The 16-bit as well as 32-bit portions of the driver both use MME, which all versions of Cool Edit can use.

In Windows 2000/XP, the majority of the drivers are written using WDM and MME. The MME portion of these drivers is needed to support older programs that don't support WDM. Usually, the MME portion of these drivers only supports up to 16-bit, while the WDM portion is needed for 24/32-bit.

That's the whole issue. CE2K can only use the MME part of the driver. In Windows 95/98/ME, this usually isn't a problem, but in Windows 2000/XP it usually is (for 24/32-bit).

Now, this isn't the case for every single soundcard and driver. There are exceptions because different soundcard drivers are written differently. One example of an exception is a Windows 98 machine I have with a built in 'SoundMAX digital Audio' card. Even in Windows 98, it won't do higher than 16-bit unless I use WDM. I've also had at least one card (can't remember exactly what it was right now) on an XP machine that supported 24-bit in the MME portion of the driver.

But anyway, I hope this information helps!

mrdgreen · Location: Canada Posts: 10

Hi Pro support,

Thanks for the info.
That's pretty much what I thought from the other posts I read in the forum.
The MAudio .27 driver is *supposed* to support 24 playback on MME I assume ("Updated 24 Bit MME support"), however, I would trust your code over theirs as far as functionality.
So my best guess is that MAudio doesn't have the driver working right, and their .29 is flakey on many systems...
As mentioned, I'll be upgrading to Audition anyway, so the 24/32-bit playback support problem is no problem...

David